Don't disrespect my imaginary friend

064 – Black, Gay, Liberal & Atheist – Matt Slick CARM

My eyeballs leaked a little last night.  One caller shared the trials of being black, gay, liberal and an Atheist living in Texas.  He has a great attitude while sharing what many would find reasonable to cause depression and anger.  Of all the challenges, the one that causes him the most grief is being black.  It hurt my heart as he shared but I believe he has found new hope from those that responded to his story last night.

Grillin with AtheistsOf course, Pastor Roy’s message was a hit and Professor Stephen did an outstanding job once again.  Matt Slick, from joined the chatroom and later joined us via our live video feed on Google Hangouts.  Unfortunately he was offended when his antics were matched by Bill Robins and Dave Foda.  I really enjoyed his appearance but I can say with sincerity that if I was in in shoes and had nothing but word games and transparent arguments I would have left too.

Christian Apologist Matt Slick

Matt Slicks arguments boil down to one thing… a personal experience.  He had one personal experience that provides him with absolution on the truth of Scripture.  When challenged with the personal experiences others have had in their religions, he called it “Demonic”.  It’s the everybody else’s experiences were fake and mine is real argument.

Personal experience is not, by itself, enough reason to believe something is true. And that’s just as true for religion as anything else. Our personal experience told us for centuries that the sun orbited the earth. To be reasonably certain that what our experience tells us is probably true, we need to rely on rigorous testing of hypotheses. Pass it on: if we say it enough times to enough people, it may get across. – Greta Christina

It could be fear or a combination of fear, indoctrination, confirmation biases and others that prevent Matt from looking at his “proof” from a position of reason and logic.  My optimism gets the better of me and I long for the day he sees the light.  What a huge asset he would be to our movement.  No longer would he be restricted by Bronze Aged ideologies, no longer would he be required to employ dishonest and squirely  answers, instead he’d be free to think, free to reason and certainly would encourage others to do the same.

We had numerous connection problems which caused many not to be able to talk with us live.  I do however record a raw file and then post it on Stitcher, iTunes, Spreaker and Libsyn in it’s full glory.  Click play above to listen to it here or use your favorite podcast app.


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The Rant

Before we have sex, we pray to invite the holy spirit in.  And why wouldn’t you.  Voyeurs are great, but invisible voyeurs who can keep the sex stuff completely reverent is far better.

Imagine your partner is super horny and want’s to stick his finger his your ass as you’re about to cum, well that can be avoided if you’ll just invite the holy ghost in the room.

It’s how I know God has no problems with threesomes.  Fuck, he, Jesus and the holy ghost are the epitome of threesomes.  So really it’s a 5 some.


Hell yea!  God, Jesus and the holy ghost watching you have sex.  It’s like fucking in the chapel or in the baptismal font.  It’s hard not to feel the spirit and remain reverent.


Some Moron, I mean Mormon lady writes a blog.  She discusses much about sex and shared once with her followers – the beauty of inviting the holy ghost in the room prior to peeling off your clothes.  I think the blog has been dormant now for a while, I mean a blog about marital intimacy among mormon couples doesn’t really have a wealth of resources to insure it’s continuation.


Although this post is years old, it’s not an uncommon thought process among Mormons.  Sex is sacred, it’s not to be shared with anyone but between you and the partner you picked out in the preexistence and of course with the holy ghost.


Mormons must continually reassure each other through articles, social media, church meetings and televised events, that their particular ideologies are normal and must be defended.


It’s not just mormons either, most Christians will do the same.  They will ban together on abortion being murder or that certain types of sex between consenting adults violates the Jesus consensus.


I remember as a teen the church officially declared oral sex to be immoral and sinful.  At the time this made perfect sense, I never questioned it.  In marriage I couldn’t avoid the temptation to go down because, hell, I’m a vagina man.  Those beautiful labia are like crack cocaine to an addict.  But each time I failed, I felt guilty and I felt bad.

Yet most every mormon, at least all TB mormons will defend these moral edicts.  There is no thought given to them, their is no reasoning or logic used.  It all comes down to whether the command given by the church authorities were inspired.  And by inspired I mean by God.


Sex is wonderful, it’s a sacred act but on the other side of the same coin are those sexual things that Satan invented.  Porn, anal, oral, dress up and make believe.  All abuses of the God given holy sex.


Is this not demonstrable evidence for religious harm?  But who does it harm?  Speaking from experience, Me, it fucking harmed me.  I lived in guilt from the time I had my first sexual thought.

But marriage brought more guilt.  I couldn’t resist the fun and sinful parts of sex.  It’s really a miserable existence.  Surrounded by Mormon friends and family, I always felt inferior.  They’d share a miracle story about how they were almost out of gas but the station manager hadn’t left yet because he spilled a bottle of grape juice on his way out the door… big miracles like that, where God intervenes daily with their lives.  All I could think, is I wonder if they could see the sin on me.


I couldn’t violate the sanctity of the all male priesthood – for I was a sinner and I couldn’t resist the temptations of oral sex.  How many Mormons feel the same, how many have pathetic and unsatisfying sex lives for fear of violating Mormon Jesus’s commands?


A family friend, also a Mormon,  had a wife, children and from all appearances a very happy home.  One day his wife found his computer with a history including porn sites.  Now in Mormon circles, you just had well built an alter to satan himself, right in the goddamned living room and invited demons into you home.  Lambs blood optional.


She reported his actions to the church authorities and he was directed into counseling for his addiction.  Of course his Priesthood callings were removed and he was put on restriction which meant he couldn’t attend church meetings nor participate in sacrament.  (which is just the mormon version of cannibalistic jesus flesh and blood eating)

In the Mormon church, to look at porn is proof of addiction.  He was a good husband, an excellent father and loved the church.   So he went.  He prayed, fasted and showed real remorse for his actions.


Months later, he was found to have fallen off the proverbial wagon again.  He was double addicted I assume.  The church gave his wife a free pass for divorce, which annulled the sacred eternal marriage in the Temple and they were done.


Children now see dad occasionally and Mom struggles to raise the children without a dad.  Lives ruined and shattered for absolutely nothing.


This story is repeated over and over and over in the LDS church.  The imaginary disease of porn addiction is rampant in the LDS community.  Utah, home to a majority population of Mormons holds the record per capita in gay porn downloads on the web according to Google Stats.


How many families are being destroyed, right now,  due to this ignorant and harmful way of thinking?  And porn is only one of the many sins that can destroy a normal and healthy family.


At one time an interracial marriage could do the same.  Fuck, the Mormon church still convicts on thought crimes.  A typically interview with the Bishop, at least annually includes:  Have you had any thoughts that are unworthy and that you have failed to repent for?”


Why yes, I was just thinking about whether your wife’s red hair and freckles were evident on her vagina too.


Fuck me, you can’t escape the guilt and remorse for being human within the membership of fucktarded Mormonism.  I now believe it’s intentional.  I know the church leaders, especially the Prophet who’s books tell him that he should be talking to God daily and that God actually will talk back, often giving commands and prophecy directly – must know it’s all horseshit.  It’s all a scam.  He must know!


Now I’ve picked on Mormons here, but the case can be made that every single religion has codes, commands, rules and edicts that call the normal unnatural and sinful.  This creates pain, it creates harm, it destroys from within and it is the essence of immorality.


Do you think that their is one healthy man on earth that doesn’t lust?  Yet every major religion forbids it.  Fuck, fake Jesus Christ himself says in the Bible that lust is the same as doing the act.  It’s an abomination and is sin.


Coincidence of ignorance or a diabolic plan to attack everyone and know that those who really believe will seek repentance.  Money, prayer but mostly money in the form of tithes and offerings are the most widely encouraged penance for your sinful ways.


Christopher Hitchens once debated that religion should be removed, that it’s harms far outweigh the claimed benefits.  Greta Christina wrote a book on the subject using modern day examples of harm.


But even if all we could select is one harm to argue our case against religion, I think it’s the biggest and most destructive to society is the guilt, the harm done by religions views on sex.


The most christian states statistically have the highest rates of sex abuse on children and the highest rates of porn downloads.  Why, because you make breathing a sin, you won’t stop it, but you will force them to seek other avenues and options to get the much needed air.


Religion has said that abstinence is the only way to satisfy Jesus, yet the states who have the most churches and the most faithful believers, they also have the most teen pregnancies and sexually transmitted diseases.  All of which demand abstinence.


Christianity is a disease, it’s a poison and it’s lethal to humanity.  It’s doctrines and edicts serve to harm the populous all the while under the guise of morality.  Fuck your morality, fuck your religious bullshit and fuck you.



4 thoughts on “064 – Black, Gay, Liberal & Atheist – Matt Slick CARM”

  1. Holy cow.

    “Next! Next! Next! I won’t. I will not have a discussion with people who are gonna equate scripture and my lord Jesus with Harry Potter!” – Matt Slick

    “If you say that the Bible is ‘just some book’, well that would be a misrepresentation.” – Matt Slick

    Like so many others, I’ve been laboring under the apparent delusion that the Bible is IN FACT “just some” old “book”! Instead of threatening to hang up, it might be helpful for him to, y’know, present a case for why his favorite book is not literally, by definition, “some book”?

    I’m left wondering: if “The Iliad” had been brought up instead of Harry Potter, would he have thrown the same fit and hung up? If not, why? They’re both works of fiction, they both describe supernatural events. Is it because The Iliad is ancient, like the Bible, and Harry Potter is a modern children’s book?

    What if Harry Potter was originally written in Greek or Hebrew, in, say, 1,000 BC; but it contained essentially the same story (adjusted for anachronisms), the same descriptions of magic powers, etc… Would the comparison still be anywhere near as offensive to Christians? I’m guessing no. Harry Potter touched a raw nerve for Slick, but has anyone ever seen a Christian rage out like that to an Iliad comparison?

    I understand that this particular book is really really important to Matt, but for someone who’s known for presenting an argument as convoluted as TAG, he ought to be able to wrap his head around the fact that his Bible IS “just some book”, as far as the vast majority of humans who have ever lived on planet earth are concerned. It’s on HIM to present a case for this book being anything other than a book. He didn’t present that case, he simply asserted it.

  2. It took me 3 days to get through this. When Slick came on he made my head hurt from ripping my hair out. I now look almost like you. I don’t think I can ever eat salad again. He is a master of salad spinning.

  3. His is a basic category error. Logic is a characteristic of the universe. It isn’t an independent thing. Logic is a description of some mechanics in the universe. Just like gravity or convection. His mistake is thinking of logic as a thing that can’t exist without minds. What can’t exist without minds are conceptions. The things that concepts are conceiving of, on the other hand, are independent of the minds conceiving them. That is, the mechanics work or don’t whether or not minds are there to conceive it.

    The way to think of this in a debate, is to ask “Can one notice gravity?” “As one notices it can one describe it and conceive of it and even understand it?” “Can one notice logic?” “Same thing.”

    If he goes on insisting that logic can’t exist without a mind, he’s implicitly asserting that this attribute of the universe (that *isn’t* ‘logic’ – that’s just a description that we’ve conceived of), that it has order and is regular is impossible unless a mind conceived of it first. *That* as a supposition that he’s presupposed as opposed to have demonstrated.

  4. I wish I could have been on this podcast with Matt Slick. I think I could have clarified his points for you and presented the proper refutations for what he claims. Too many falsities were discussed for me to comment here, but if he comes back I would love to call in. Atheists don’t presuppose the non-existence of god. I for example simply take the null position because I approach the question objectively.

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